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Why I love the suburbs
Dipping into the pool of requests, I pull out the following:
[My request is] the suburbs, where you work. Should DC gather around its Metro? Or do you revel in the automobile and the interesting diversity that it has wrought? Should we all pine for Jane Jacobs walking neighborhoods? I ask in honor of her, though it's hard to isolate the relevant factors.
I favor the suburbs for several reasons...
1. We live 30 minutes from Washington but we also have a fox in the backyard. Deer are a frequent sight as well.
2. Chinese restaurants are usually better in the suburbs these days.
3. Driving is fun and a good way to experience music. MR readers know I favor a (revenue-neutral) gas tax. My worry is that car culture makes people more individualistic and thus I have some reluctance to tax this trend. Try Chuck Berry's "No Particular Place To Go."
4. A few weeks ago, the first Fairfax County police officer died in the line of duty. That's the first ever. In New Jersey, where I grew up, you might speak of the first local cop to die today.
5. Many of my friends who live in Manhattan lose interest in global travel or never acquire it. Sadly they feel they already have everything they need from the world right at home.
Natasha and I talk of retiring in New York City. But are we up for it? I've started subscribing to New York magazine. Sometimes it is interesting; more to the point I can pretend I might someday live there.
I'll cover Jane Jacobs soon.
Posted by Tyler Cowen on May 24, 2006 at 01:56 AM in Education | Permalink
Comments
Unfortunately those who purchase residential property and those who live in it are not one and the same. Consider the average teen trapped in the remote exurbs of a sprawling city, with arterial roads not designed for bikes (and in the US, continental weather often incompatible with cycling), and no public transport. I was amazed when I lived in Kansas City how many colleagues regarded the place as a paradise for children, when to me it looked like a prison with a super-expensive private parent-run taxi system. Give me my urban London commuter town upbringing any day!
Posted by: Martin Geddes at May 24, 2006 6:05:10 AM
Central London has foxes too.
Posted by: Jack at May 24, 2006 6:09:54 AM
You favor a gas tax OO You must be crazy! Look at Germany and our wonderful eco-gas-tax we have there. It only made driving a car more expensive, but didn't change the way people go to work. Only recently with the half-hearted privatisation of the Deutsche Bahn has a change come to it (with reasonable services at the train services) - although there is still much to lament over this "privatisation".
Gasoline in Germany costs roughly 6 dollar a gallon and 65 % of this price is due to taxes. It has started with a low tax, but whenever you politically start to tax something, the tax will increase over time to fund excessive spending of government institutions.
Now, Germany is essentially still a country of car-lovers, despite the greenish eco-religion trying to trump that (it might be that the heritage of Daimler, Otto and such is still influential here). So, this tax is one of the many factors preventing mobility, which has resulted in clustered cities, where you stand in traffic queues a long time, but only have a short way to drive.
It is the most unefficient way to use the car, economically speaking...
Posted by: Max at May 24, 2006 6:11:26 AM
Geddes
I agree completely. One result of the collapse of the tram system was that
teens were restricted to their home area of the city. Travel
opportunities for adults increased at the same time as they decreased for
teens. Ditto for farms when horses were replaced by tractors as far as
mobility for teens were concerned. Women also lost mobility if they were
carless as compared to husbands with cars in one car families.
Posted by: wkwillis at May 24, 2006 6:12:29 AM
I know many DC snobs who would never condescend to cross the river (water! eek!) who nonetheless love to travel, so that may be a New-York-City-specific attitude. On the other hand, inflated as the DC real estate market is, it's still at least two orders of magnitute cheaper than Manhattan, so simple living expenses might explain it.
My favorite New Yorker-parochialism moment was when I was chastized for not going to experience "the best Japanese food in the world." I had just returned from Japan.
Posted by: Sandy Smith at May 24, 2006 6:46:44 AM
Driving is fun? In DC?
And I wholly agree with Martin Geddes. The people I know who grew up in the suburbs describe it as miserable for teenagers.
Posted by: The Other Brock at May 24, 2006 7:37:35 AM
"Unfortunately those who purchase residential property and those who live in it are not one and the same. Consider the average teen trapped in the remote exurbs of a sprawling city, with arterial roads not designed for bikes (and in the US, continental weather often incompatible with cycling), and no public transport."
I think it's worth keeping in mind that suburban communities vary enormously (as do conditions within a particular community). I grew up in a suburb that was very bikeable, and we rode our bikes absolutely everywhere--to school, to parks, to shops, to the movies. Now I live in a medium-sized city (Ann Arbor, MI) in a suburban-style neighborhood near the univeristy and a large park (out of which deer do wander from time to time). But it's a short, easy bike or walk downtown, and my kids do that a lot (so do my wife and I--it's simpler than finding a place to park).
But there are also many new 'McMansion' developments farther out where nothing is within bike range and kids do have to be chauffeured everywhere. Both 'suburban' neighborhoods in the same city, but very different conditions.
Posted by: Slocum at May 24, 2006 8:10:10 AM
Umm, "paradise for children" and for teenagers are diametrically opposite things. And parents may _prefer_ an environment where it is hard for their teenagers to move around without them. Teenagers also don't pay the higher costs of housing and good schools in cities, which are probably the #1 and #2 factors in how parents evaluate an area's suitability for raising children. Yes, good public schools are expensive, you just pay in the real estate market instead of in tuition.
I live in a neighborhood where kids regularly play in the streets and in the front lawns and see the occasional rabbit. When my kid reaches 16 I would be shocked if he cares about either.
Posted by: DK at May 24, 2006 8:27:40 AM
My memories of Zaragoza, Spain, remain very strong. It's the 5th largest city in Spain (650K people according to Wikipedia) but so compact you can easily walk from the city centre to the edge of town. And when you reach the edge of town it just stops. Literally one side of the road is seven storey apartment buildings and the other side is just countryside. Who needs suburbia when you can have that?
Posted by: Noel Welsh at May 24, 2006 8:35:25 AM
I grew up in Fairfax County (ages 4-18) and I loved it. I didn't feel imprisoned at all, and I'm fully behind all of Dr. Cowen's reasons to like the suburbs (well, these suburbs at least). Northern Virginia could use a larger body of apologetics if for no other reason than to persuade DC-dwellers who would never deign to leave "the City" (please!) for something like The Best Damn Vietnamese Food Ever (Four Sisters), to get over themselves.
Posted by: Phil at May 24, 2006 8:38:04 AM
When you talk about Jacobs, would you mention at least in passing whether you think "early Jacobs" and "later Jacobs" has more to give us, or whether they are both just as important. The NYT had an article a few weeks ago, after she died, about how Death and the Life was a breakthrough, but her later work on sprawl made less of a contribution. I've been wondering myself.
Posted by: scott cunningham at May 24, 2006 9:10:43 AM
When are teenagers ever happy?
Posted by: Tom at May 24, 2006 9:24:30 AM
I grew up in a middle class suburb of Detroit and whined constantly as a teenager that there was nothing to do. About 15 years after graduating from high school, my wife and I looked for a house and quickly realized the best location was the same suburb I couldn't wait to escape from as a teen. Recently the city polled teens and found they had nothing to do.
My wife taught high school for ten years and heard the same sob story at every school she taught at. The schools ranged from rural to exurb to inner-ring suburb and nobody ever had anything to do. I would wager that teens in downtown Manhattan say they have nothing to do.
Our city spends a lot of tax dollars to provide things to do, such as a very large community center. Teens have far more electronic distractions than I had and I had plenty. There are two malls within our city limits, numerous parks and one of the best libraries in the state. There are numerous extra-cirricular activties offered by the schools and within the community. But still teens have nothing to do.
And they have more mobility than ever, not less. There are 238 million vehicles in operation in the United States. There are few, if any, suburban teens who don't have access to an automobile and a driver within their age range.
Yes, I'll admit I had less to do as a suburban teen than my father had to do as a teen in the glory that was World War II era Detroit. That's because he had a full-time job while in high school because his family had no money.
Suburb bashing is one of the most tiresome hobbies on the intellectual class. I am so glad Tyler is standing up to it.
Posted by: Ted Craig at May 24, 2006 9:25:43 AM
I'll simply follow up on a prior comment and say that there are suburbs and there are suburbs. Ones with a reasonable population density seems more liveable than the sprawling ones where one must drive long distances for anything. Based on my limited experience, I believe that most parts of Fairfax County are of the former type and therefore can offer a satisfactory blend of convenience and spaciousness.
Posted by: Peter at May 24, 2006 9:36:57 AM
Deer=Rats on Stilts.
Posted by: Robert Schwartz at May 24, 2006 9:42:31 AM
"Teens complain that they have nothing to do but...but but but but we offer them a very large community center!" I mean, wow, a community center: that's way better than music clubs, coffee shops, and dance clubs. Malls? More and more malls and banning teenagers. And, gee willikers Beaver, we can go to the library! Good idea Wally!
Teens don't want to spoon fed their activities -- it is a stage of life virtually defined by a growing attempt to define 'self' separately from the one imposed by surrounding adults -- so I fail to see how extracurricular activities offered by the school and community fill the void.
Teen activities should not be planned. Teen entertainment should be *emergent* not part of some misguided Soviet-inspired Five-Year Plan for the untermensch.
Posted by: Justus at May 24, 2006 9:47:54 AM
In terms of suburbs, I think DC is unique; the choice isn't as clear when one is talking about NYC v. NYC suburbs, where commuting time makes a big difference, and the commuter tax takes away much of the DC suburban benefit. Here, commuting from the suburbs might save time relative to commuting over the inferior DC roads. It is regularly a mystery to me why people in the DC area pay an additional 3% of their incomes (not to mention higher real estate prices) for the privilege of living in a higher-crime neighborhood with worse public services and schools and restaurants. In the Wilson Corridor, I'm closer to downtown than people in Upper NW, I'm around taller buildings than DC has, I have cheaper expenses and better markets and quality of life.
Posted by: Ted at May 24, 2006 9:48:58 AM
I thought we were supposed to be worry about today's teenagers being overscheduled, sleep deprived resume builders. Will someone let me know next time I'm supposed to flip to a completely opposite worry?
Posted by: DK at May 24, 2006 9:49:48 AM
The only thing that I really don't like about the suburbs is the entitlement mindset that it encourages. People leave cities (or closer in suburbs) and move out to the 'open' and enjoy the amenities involved with being out there.
And then they immediately do everything in their power to prevent other people from spoling their new life and lifestyle, either by horrible 5 or 10 or more acre zoning, ridiculous growth management plans and the like.. It generates this false sense of the ability to control something that really can't be controlled..
(not to say that people in cities don't feel a similar sense of entitlement, its just far less possible for them to do much about it, with so many more thngs being outside of the bounds of control)
Posted by: Perry at May 24, 2006 10:14:55 AM
"My worry is that car culture makes people more individualistic and thus I have some reluctance to tax this trend."
Gee, I'd hate to kill somebody's free spirit just because some individuals find *poisoning my lungs with their exhaust* increases their individualism. If they want their free motion 'bout the Earth, let 'em internalize the cost of it, thanks.
Posted by: wheezer at May 24, 2006 10:24:58 AM
"A few weeks ago, the first Fairfax County police officer died in the line of duty. That's the first ever."
This is an artificial creation of zoning which keeps poor people out of Fairfax County, and not something inherent about suburbs.
Posted by: Half Sigma at May 24, 2006 10:25:32 AM
"My worry is that car culture makes people more individualistic..."
My perception is that the suburbs have less diversity in race, ethnicity, religion, or (expressed) sexual preference. Am I mistaken about this? Or am I perhaps wrong in thinking that this variety creates space for individualism?
Posted by: Bill Gardner at May 24, 2006 10:27:44 AM
Bill - homosexual orientation is highly correlated with certain cities, but it's a positive sorting on the part of that demographic. (See the Black, et al. paper "Why Do Gay Men Live in San Francisco?")
There was an interesting paper, too, by Thomas Nechbya entitled "Mobility, Targeting and Private School Vouchers (AER 2000) that argues segregation by income (which in the US means by race) is an effect of the current public school system that zones by district. To select schools, families select neighborhoods, and this probably does fuel migrations into suburbs and out of the cities. A voucher system, Nechbya shows, leads to less geographic segregation.
The former thing about gays and the city probably has more to do with the relatively high incomes of the homosexual demographic (relatively high levels of human capital) combined with a mode of 0 children in the family. As a result, cities with expensive amenities are affordable. Suburbs, though, are populated by families, in part for the same reason. The latter thing about school finance, though, speaks to an unintended effect of using geographic zoning that results in the kind of segregation you're noticing.
Posted by: scott cunningham at May 24, 2006 10:48:42 AM
"About 15 years after graduating from high school, my wife and I looked for a house and quickly realized the best location was the same suburb I couldn't wait to escape from as a teen. Recently the city polled teens and found they had nothing to do. "
You are allowed to leave the suburb whenever you feel like it. That makes quite a difference.
"When are teenagers ever happy?"
When they're finally standing on their own two feet and taking their place as useful, free members of society.
"Yes, I'll admit I had less to do as a suburban teen than my father had to do as a teen in the glory that was World War II era Detroit. That's because he had a full-time job while in high school because his family had no money."
So why can't we cut out summer breaks, let them finish high school sooner and have full time jobs? People get kind of depressed when they have nothing useful to do. Sitting in Mickey Mouse classes and trying to stay awake doesn't count.
Posted by: Ken at May 24, 2006 10:54:22 AM
Many of my friends who live in Manhattan lose interest in global travel or never acquire it. Sadly they feel they already have everything they need from the world right at home.
Odd. My urban friends like travel very much. In my experience it is suburbanites who cannot imagine there is anything abroad worth the trouble. Of course, I'm generalizing from a relatively small group of people. What about you?
Posted by: Bernard Yomtov at May 24, 2006 11:26:10 AM
